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OTHER THINGS IN THE WORLD THAN MUSIC => Everything and Nothing => Topic started by: Wayne Higgins on November 01, 2009, 06:19:04 AM

Title: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: Wayne Higgins on November 01, 2009, 06:19:04 AM
I didn't want to look for the old one, so...

I definately got it, that screaming ring in my ears.  The final straw between occasional and permanant was The Dropkick Murphys concert last winter.  Oh, well.  Had to happen sometime.

Anyway, why I brought this up was that I found a pretty good product for it.  Not a cure (there is none), but definately helps.  I got something called "Bio Ear" from a Vermont General Store catalog.  You the liquid on a cotton ball and then stick it in your ear for a few hours.  I got up in the middle of the night hearing a Les Paul and Marshall amp feedback sound.  But this stuff in and actually went back to sleep.  It's made of all natural ingredients:  Aloe Vera is the top ingredient.  Check it out, it's worth it.
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: Blackinfinity on November 01, 2009, 05:35:19 PM
Sorry to hear about your tinnitus, I feel your pain.

I have a mild form of tinnitus, mostly audible in absolute silence, but when I play loud music it can increase...
I am worried that with time it will get worse....

I am scared for that, I have more or less decided to not go to concerts anymore... at least not until I have got professional ear plugs... but I am not risking anything at the moment... not worth it...maybe you think I am boring ?
But I don't really care, I value my ears above anything, and I could not imagine a life without them.

If the audience would shut up and not scream all the time, we would not need to have such extreme audio levels on concerts..Another irritating aspect on rock concerts is the BASS, I prefer a more flat EQ curve it sounds better then a lot of bass... sure it gives a more mind blowing experience..but at the same time it sounds like crap also..
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: SunDummy on November 01, 2009, 06:54:06 PM
Interesting - I'll have to try it.  I've had that damn ringing in my ears since I was a little kid, nothing helps, so I just ignore it and hope it doesn't get worse.  I avoid loud concerts, and if a band starts up in a bar I just happen to be in, I leave.  I wear ear protection when using any woodworking tools (saws, etc.), and sometimes sleep with earplugs in just to enjoy the isolation.

I heard an interesting show on NPR a week or two ago about tinnitus (on science Friday, I think).  Seems that folks w/tinnitus also tend to find loud noises or specific sounds (like dropping a bottle into the recycling bin) physically painful.  Not just irritating, but actually painful.  They're currently looking into the mechanism for this effect. 

Maybe that helps explain my love of silence, and ambient music in general?  Anybody else?
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: petekelly on November 02, 2009, 07:12:06 AM
You fellers have my sympathies. I'm lucky in that I only have it very mildly (despite years of
listening to music, primarily on headphones/earphones). I did have an ear infection about 18 months
ago and got a very unpleasant High frequency 'zinging' sound which was loud and uncomfortable,
luckily it went away with the infection.

Blackinfinity don't worry about being thought of as boring - you're right to look after your
hearing.

Sundummy, I think thats a good point. I love silence too and maybe there's some link between this
and ambient music ?

I know it's stating the obvious but be careful with earplugs/earphones, from a hygiene point of
view. The inner ear canal is a great place to breed nasty infections !

cheers
Pete
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: lena on November 02, 2009, 12:10:53 PM
Quote
Seems that folks w/tinnitus also tend to find loud noises or specific sounds (like dropping a bottle into the recycling bin) physically painful.

OUCH, yes, that kills! I have really bad, constant tinnitus and I hate it! I also have some pretty serious hearing loss, (especially in one ear.) It's hereditary- my mother, her father, two of her sisters and one of her brothers all have/ had hearing aids in both ears. I'm going to the ear doctor very soon and will most likely end up with them myself, (oh, joy of joys)... ::)

About the bottle-dropping thang: I always set the bottles down very gently in the recycle bin, so as NOT to cause that horrible, painful crashing sound, (which also makes my ears ring about ten times louder for awhile if I drop one accidentally.)
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: SunDummy on November 02, 2009, 01:05:35 PM
Bummer Lena, seems like your fate is genetic...   :(

In my case, I'm the only one in my family with this; it hasn't really changed much in the last 40 years - maybe a bit louder, and no hearing loss yet - so I'm hoping it'll just be an always-present nuisance rather than a sign of worse things to come.

I have to wear earplugs when I dump the recycling (they don't pick it up here, so I have to go into town), that is the most painful sound! 
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: Mark Mushet on November 02, 2009, 01:23:36 PM
Oddly enough, I picked it up in Portland after flying with a headcold. 30 years of concerts, drag racing and gunfire...and it was a routine flight from Spokane to Portland in a Dash-8 in, I think, 2002 that actually brought it on, albeit mildly. It's the combo of repeated air pressure changes with all that goes on around your ears when you have a cold. Extremely painful at the time.

BTW caffiene makes it worse. You may notice it more after drinking coffee or eating chocolate.
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: lena on November 02, 2009, 02:35:24 PM
Quote
You may notice it more after drinking coffee or eating chocolate.

Oh no, two of my very favorite things!  :(

Another problem I have with my ears is that they don't pop, like when I'm on an airplane or driving through the mountains- the pressure just builds and builds until I can barely hear anything at all. I take decongestants before I fly and sometimes it helps a teeny bit, but I've had some horribly painful landings where it feels like someone is jamming icepicks into my eardrums. I'm thinking I have inner ear issues...
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: Mark Mushet on November 02, 2009, 02:51:12 PM
Quote
You may notice it more after drinking coffee or eating chocolate.

Oh no, two of my very favorite things!  :(

Another problem I have with my ears is that they don't pop, like when I'm on an airplane or driving through the mountains- the pressure just builds and builds until I can barely hear anything at all. I take decongestants before I fly and sometimes it helps a teeny bit, but I've had some horribly painful landings where it feels like someone is jamming icepicks into my eardrums. I'm thinking I have inner ear issues...


Yes, I use the ice pick description as well. Unfortunately it happens to small children and babies as well. During flights they are unable to communicate the nature of their pain and end up with hearing damage nobody attributed to early flights with colds.

I'm on the day's 2nd coffee, a bunch of Nutella and weeeee it sounds like the morning after a
Meat Beat Manifesto concert!  ;)
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: sraymar on November 02, 2009, 04:08:29 PM
I've had constant tinnitus since mid-march of this year. Prior to that I always had a low level of it but then I started noticing about a year and a half back that my ears would start ringing a couple hours before bed, then upon waking it would be back down to normal. I used to wear headphones alot, particularly with my POD guitar amp simulator. I believe that's what put me over the edge. It was incredibly bad for the first few months off and on because it fluctuates in volume, balance, and is sometimes accompanied with hiss but it normally just sounds like two or three high pitched sine waves of different pitches.

The ultra severe tinnitus has backed off since I quit using headphones, and I use ear plugs for live music and movies. I've also tried alot of kundalini meditation. When I wake up to take a leak at times I'll notice my tinnitus is louder than usual but that could be that I don't notice it at all when I'm asleep or when I go back to sleep. Interesting how the brain does that! Its really all in the mind, but then so is the brain. Something to think about.

Steve
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: Mark Mushet on November 02, 2009, 05:29:55 PM
Its really all in the mind, but then so is the brain. Something to think about.

I love this!
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: Blackinfinity on November 02, 2009, 05:50:07 PM
I've had constant tinnitus since mid-march of this year. Prior to that I always had a low level of it but then I started noticing about a year and a half back that my ears would start ringing a couple hours before bed, then upon waking it would be back down to normal. I used to wear headphones alot, particularly with my POD guitar amp simulator. I believe that's what put me over the edge. It was incredibly bad for the first few months off and on because it fluctuates in volume, balance, and is sometimes accompanied with hiss but it normally just sounds like two or three high pitched sine waves of different pitches.

The ultra severe tinnitus has backed off since I quit using headphones, and I use ear plugs for live music and movies. I've also tried alot of kundalini meditation. When I wake up to take a leak at times I'll notice my tinnitus is louder than usual but that could be that I don't notice it at all when I'm asleep or when I go back to sleep. Interesting how the brain does that! Its really all in the mind, but then so is the brain. Something to think about.

Steve

My advice too you, never play Guitar with headphones, I try to avoid it. In my experience, you usually need to crank up the volume very high to overloud the guitar itself but also to get that power you want...  to use an compressor might be a good idea to get a more even dynamic range...even though it might not sound better...it is definitely better for your ears...less dangerous peaks to worry about, I can definitely feel that my ears take damage when I play guitar loud with headphones... my tinnitus gets little bit higher for a while, until I have rested my ears over the night.

but really try to use speakers as much as possible.  Headphones in general are way more strainfull for the ear in long-term, you get a lot higher sound-pressure towards the ear drums when using headphones... even though the perceived loudness might not feel like that..

Also as always the better equipment you have usually the lower volume you need to get that good sound that does not sound weak and powerless.
Most people have averege speakers, and you need to play them really loud to get a good sound, in fact, everything will sound good loud.
So good Speakers and Headphones I recommend.. if you can afford it of course.
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: lena on November 02, 2009, 06:15:24 PM
I've noticed that my deafness and tinnitus get a lot worse if I'm in the studio with the headphones on for prolonged periods of time, (which I have been a lot lately, and it's worse than ever right now!)

I'm actually going to the ear doctor this coming Friday, so I guess I'll keep everyone posted as to how things turn out, (I am so NOT excited about this)...  :(





Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: Scott M2 on November 02, 2009, 06:58:45 PM
My advice too you, never play Guitar with headphones, I try to avoid it. In my experience, you usually need to crank up the volume very high to overloud the guitar itself but also to get that power you want...  

Cranking your guitar up to get good feedback and sustain is also a bad idea when using headphones.


Sorry!
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: sraymar on November 03, 2009, 12:31:16 AM
Quote
My advice too you, never play Guitar with headphones, I try to avoid it. In my experience, you usually need to crank up the volume very high to overloud the guitar itself but also to get that power you want...  to use an compressor might be a good idea to get a more even dynamic range...even though it might not sound better...it is definitely better for your ears...less dangerous peaks to worry about, I can definitely feel that my ears take damage when I play guitar loud with headphones... my tinnitus gets little bit higher for a while, until I have rested my ears over the night.

but really try to use speakers as much as possible.  Headphones in general are way more strainfull for the ear in long-term, you get a lot higher sound-pressure towards the ear drums when using headphones... even though the perceived loudness might not feel like that..

Also as always the better equipment you have usually the lower volume you need to get that good sound that does not sound weak and powerless.Most people have averege speakers, and you need to play them really loud to get a good sound, in fact, everything will sound good loud. So good Speakers and Headphones I recommend.. if you can afford it of course.


Well as I mentioned I quit using headphones, in fact as far back as March of this year. In the POD's defense it sounds great at any volume and these days I plug it into a small Marshall amp that's basically a toy and it sounds great to noodle on. It sounds good on anything you plug it into except an amp with a digital front end.
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: petekelly on November 03, 2009, 03:44:22 AM
Sorry to hear about your problems Lena,

There's nothing wrong with using headphones for guitar (or anything else). For sure, its very
different than hearing a hefty guitar sound from an amp. I use phones primarily as I prefer the
sense of 'immersion' you can get, particularly with ambient music.

Of course, you have to be careful with the volume levels. In my experience, a worse-case scenario is
electronic music with beats listened to repeatedly when creating a track on phones (and particularly
earphones). Now, that's potentially damaging.

cheers
Pete
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: Brian Bieniowski on November 03, 2009, 06:58:28 AM
I've had mild tinnitus since childhood as well.  I can remember listening to it as a kid thinking it was the sound of silence.  Little did I know!  Thankfully it has not gotten worse, nor is it really that noticeable unless I'm in an extremely quiet room. 

It's definitely very sinus related for me.  I'm always careful during scuba diving (where clearing ear passages is a crucial skill), and I started wearing those soft gel earplugs at every concert, no matter how quiet it is.  After six (!) days of ear ringing from a very loud New Order concert, I decided it was best to be safe than sorry with a miserable condition doctors can't help with.
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: Seren on November 03, 2009, 10:13:46 AM
reading your posts I feel very lucky - I can hear whistling and sometimes other noises if I am in a silent environment, usually as I drift off to sleep. Occasionally i can hear a whistle go off  at other times but it fades away.

Given I used to lay in the bass bins at Motorhead gigs in my youth :o I am very lucky. ;D it was interesting to hear sound at such an intensity that it was as much felt...it was also a great way of catching up with mates who would know where to find me....

I do find that long listening to music with headphones can make my ears 'almost ache' with an increase of tinnitus afterwards.....
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: lena on November 03, 2009, 11:53:22 AM
Quote
Given I used to lay in the bass bins at Motorhead gigs in my youth

Ha ha, wow!  ;D


Quote
After six (!) days of ear ringing from a very loud New Order concert


New Order? I'm jealous!!!
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: jdh on November 04, 2009, 11:19:39 PM
Oh,New Order.Amazing band but their live sound was renowned for being bad.Saw them in 82,85,88,2001.
Ear plugs,it is the only way to see live audio but go for the pro custom molds like ER-15s from Westone.
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: Wayne Higgins on November 05, 2009, 08:11:13 AM
Brian Bieniowski
Quote
It's definitely very sinus related for me.
Oh yeah.  I've been dealing with a on again/off again head cold.  The liquid in the inner ear makes me wake up like I'm back at the Amboy Dukes concert.
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: mgriffin on November 05, 2009, 09:37:50 AM
Oh,New Order.Amazing band but their live sound was renowned for being bad.Saw them in 82,85,88,2001.
Ear plugs,it is the only way to see live audio but go for the pro custom molds like ER-15s from Westone.

Agreed about New Order.  I saw them in the late 80s and it was fun, but the performance was sloppy and the sound was distorted.  Peter Hook was unbelievably wasted, Gillian Gilbert looked like somebody's great aunt standing behind the keyboards, Stephen Morris seemed to be on speed or something, and Barney's vocals were a bit haphazard.  Still, I'm glad I saw them when I had the chance.
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: Scott M2 on November 05, 2009, 12:06:10 PM
Also saw New Order in Toronto the late 80s (I think) and was not impressed: uninspired, poor sound, etc...

Years later I read an interview where they declared that show as their worst ever,
as they had big technical difficulties before they even started.

I remember having enjoyed the opening act though. Magic Dragon, I think.

Here's to hearing... Cheers!
Title: Re: Tinnitus, part two
Post by: jdh on November 05, 2009, 11:12:44 PM
Scott,I saw New Order in TO in 85 near the airport for the Low Life tour.A Certain Ratio opened.I read the same review.Quite awful,pretty much what Mike said but on record,they are on of my favorites.Temptation is in my top 5 songs ever.Check out Barneys new band-Bad Lieutenant,not my thing but a few decent tracks.
PS- just came back from one of my installs in a club,20 minutes there and my ears are ringing,just too loud but the kids love it and the DJs just keep pushing the levels up.I got it locked down with compressors and limiters but the client says louder,so what can you do.