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OTHER THINGS IN THE WORLD THAN MUSIC => Art and Literature, Movies and TV => Topic started by: judd stephens on June 12, 2012, 04:38:16 PM

Title: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: judd stephens on June 12, 2012, 04:38:16 PM
Of all the movies that have made an attempt to revive an old series or jumpstart a trilogy, Prometheus is the most deserving I've seen.  In fact Ridley now has 2 trilogies on the hook if I'm right in that he also said his Robin Hood was intended to be more than just one movie.  I would rather he in Peter Jackson fashion just focus on Prometheus.  I found Noomi Rapace to be excellent- I like her intrepid curiosity, not only after the surgery going with Weylan and David to the 'bridge' of the ship, but of course her semi-vengeful desire to seek out the humanoid aliens. 

That leads me to my first question:  David says there are other ships, and obviously there are as they leave in one.  So why are the aliens in hypersleep?  Were they in the other ship too? 

Drone On I thought to create this in case you'd also like to post your critique here


.  I wanted to leave my comments shorter and broken into several posts so as to not have huge paragraphs of my own analysis or questions...
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: judd stephens on June 12, 2012, 04:54:33 PM
In reply to what Altus said: take the two who were left in the pyramid (what they called it) when the storm arrived. At first, they reacted in a realistic manner when they found the bodies stacked in the hallway. Then they entered the storage room containing the oozing vases, and the mutated worms came. Now one of the characters is completely fearless, practically begging to be killed like an idiot in a horror movie.

That's a funny observation and a good one.  My thought when I was watching it was why in the world did they return to that chamber?  I can buy that as a biologist which that character in fact was, might be a bit more intrepid and curious than your average person, wouldn't he at least think that thing could be venomous.  Yes, he was almost treating it like a pet kitten  ;D


Another example is when David has Shaw on the table, telling her she's pregnant, and then sedates her. She wakes to find two people prepping her for hypersleep. She fights them off (why didn't they give chase?) and uses the auto-surgery machine to remove the alien.
Then she returns to find David and some others, who seem completely okay that she escaped. In my opinion, this is a clear example of something that was left on the cutting room floor.


That David wouldn't show much emotion is understandable, both for his being an android and to hide his obvious maliciously intentioned programming.  I did like his quip "I didn't know you had it in you" then quick apology for the pun- it seemed like I was the only one in the theatre laughing at that.  As far as the two who tried to sedate her, I am pretty sure they were unaware of the alien inside.  There was little if any interaction between those specific characters beyond that scene if I remember right.  Also not remembering the way she escaped, she may have disoriented them enough to get away- again not sure if she could have just eluded them as they had no clue where she was headed.  My possible gripe:  wasn't the operation room part of Meredith Vickers' separate living quarters?  How was Shaw (Noomi's character) able to access that so readily? 

Agreed that the editing seemed as if more could have been there, easily.  Given a Ridley Scott film chances are that was it.  I could have happily watched a 3 hr. extended version.   As the more positive reviewers said, I found what actually did make it to be pretty engrossing and was left wanting more. 
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: judd stephens on June 12, 2012, 05:05:42 PM
Julio said:  All in all I enjoyed it.  Have to say the one link to the original Alien 1 movie that was messed up is the Super Human chases  Shaw after his spacecraft crashes  near the end of the movie.  In the first Alien the Superhuman is found in the chair thing with its chest exploded out.  They were so close to putting the 2 movies together.  Must be to link up another movie yet to come other wise it just terrible continuity 

Well this is the grand question.  It's not LV 426, remember that was the name of the planet in Alien (and Aliens correct?).   Either case it's a different planet altogether from scene with the derelict craft we saw in the 1st movie.   The planet Prometheus lands on is LV 221 or something.   Also the alien that bursts from the humanoid looks different- the mouth is a little different and the teeth aren't razor sharp like the ones we know and love.  So they must go through further evolution/DNA mixing along the way...
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: Antdude on June 12, 2012, 10:13:22 PM
It appears that some plot threads were shortened for the release. It's been confirmed that a 'Director's Cut' will be released on video in October. It's already available for pre-order on Amazon.

Here's a link to an interview with Ridley Scott: http://collider.com/ridley-scott-prometheus-deleted-scenes-interview/172202/ (http://collider.com/ridley-scott-prometheus-deleted-scenes-interview/172202/)
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: Seren on June 12, 2012, 11:51:44 PM
So the film is good enough for the director to release a cut at a later date, but not have that cut released as 'the film itself'? :o

Don't mean to gripe but it does bug me.

Thanks for starting the thread and it looks like this might be the film I know the best when I finally sit down and watch it - makes it an interesting process in itself
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: Altus on June 13, 2012, 04:20:08 AM
Thanks for the link, Antdude. I have to say, I'm glad they cut out a "fight scene" between Shaw and the Engineer. I hope this 20 minutes of footage is sprinkled throughout the film to fill the needed gaps.
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: mystified on June 13, 2012, 04:45:03 AM
Just saw and really enjoyed the film. I understand the gripes about plot, but I was able to appreciate the film as being somewhat fanciful (albeit dark)-- it felt like a work of science fiction, full of amazing visuals and interesting and strange ideas. So, something where you really have to suspend your disbelief anyway.

Visually, just very impressive.

As a musician, I did wish the score had more variety. A small complaint.
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: judd stephens on June 13, 2012, 09:41:20 AM
Thanks for the link, Antdude. I have to say, I'm glad they cut out a "fight scene" between Shaw and the Engineer. I hope this 20 minutes of footage is sprinkled throughout the film to fill the needed gaps.

There are relatively few scenes with the Engineer.  On the one hand I like that it was tantalizingly few, which kind of keeps us on the hook in a good way and also leaves a lot up to mystery.  On the other hand, I wouldn't mind at least seeing that fight scene.  That was one thing I was thinking right afterward that some of the most intense scenes like that were so "bang bang" that after waiting till the end of the movie the payoff was relatively short (the ship crashing was pretty glorious and drawn out though)  I can't imagine that fight scene without some kind of equipment Shaw would need as an equalizer, a la Ripley in the lift machine vs. the Queen...

As some have mentioned the plot hole with Shaw and the lack of resolution between her and the crew members who were trying to sedate her ( I can accept it as something that got resolved in the story "off camera" but needed to be skipped due to relevancy of the more pressing theme)  what I'm wondering now is the squid like alien??  So how much time had elapsed from the surgery to the moment where it is let out full grown?

I guess one could buy that it was trapped in the medic room and everyone was preoccupied (including Vickers) but how did it get so gosh darned big, trapped in there?  This incidentally could have been a plot hole in the original Alien.  How did the Alien grow and what did it feed on?  You rarely if ever hear that gripe when the movie is mentioned.   Maybe because the characters in Alien are so well developed and the story is good enough that it hardly matters. 

What I'd like to see also in the extra minutes would be a little more character interaction.  This was a big movie and Ridley did try to fit a lot in,  one is led to believe that there is more of a plot development on Earth (given the previews), but some of the dialogue was fairly profound- ironic that a lot of the better scenes where big questions are asked come from the Android.  I liked the certain tension that existed between him and some of the crew members.  The line where the Shaw's boyfriend says something like "the latest versions are so similar to humans or something" and David replies with "I hope not too similar" was so ambiguously brilliant, and there were quite a few things David said to that effect. 

Shaw, David and Vickers were very good performances and I thought once we found out more about the bit characters I liked them too (the captain and the mohawked geologist most notably).  So any more footage could flesh them out or feature more dialogue perhaps.  I thought the plot twist with Weylan being alive was alright- the idea that he was just going to walk up to the Engineer and have a chat about fixing his pesky mortality thing was silly- then again an aging senile and once fearless tycoon could behave that way, sort of oblivious to reality and his own imminent doom.   At least a kind of movie with ambitions this grand has one talking and thinking afterward, even if it's to fill in the gaps. 
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: drone on on June 13, 2012, 01:03:29 PM
Ridley had such a wonderful opportunity to make fabulous film--then after 20 min. into the movie he took a dump all over it.   8)
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: drone on on July 13, 2012, 10:32:15 AM
Notice how this topic hasn't gotten a new post in one month?  I think it shows how "forgettable" this movie actually was.  I was so unmotivated that I never even wrote my official review!  I will probably rent the DVD when it comes out so I can give it another try, but for now "Prometheus" is just a distant memory, like a star light years away.  ;D
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: Bill Binkelman on July 13, 2012, 11:33:40 AM
I hate to say "I told you so!" but here's my post from back in March when many folks everywhere on the 'net were hyperventilating about the film, especially at aintitcool.com:

"I have seen too many trailers that looked equally awesome and the final film didn't deliver. Admittedly, this looks fantastic, but I will wait for opening night...I have had too many expectations dashed on the rocks of reality. A lot of films can be assembled into an amazing trailer and the resulting film is only "okay" so we will see. Also, I hope Scott knows what he is doing screwing around with the Alien mythos. Lucas did that with the prequel and we got "midocholorians."

And no, I still haven't seen it, because aside from the visuals, it sounds awful. When the film finally comes to the second run Riverview near my house (the best place to see a film in the Twin Cities, IMO), I will break down go see it just so I can say I saw it.
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: judd stephens on July 13, 2012, 03:36:09 PM
The only reason I stopped was because people seemed to be interested in just posting their initial reaction to the movie, but not really in engaging in any kin of real musings.  I posed a few questions for thought and responses to others' reactions, but nothing happened.  Maybe you're right droneon, it's because people wanted to dismiss it rather than give it a second thought. 

I haven't totally forgotten about the movie though- just the other day I saw this:  PROMETHEUS WALKTHROUGH (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k-YjyI2_K30#ws)

It's the best defense I've seen yet, and I think it does it some justice.  Still looking forward to seeing it again and any director's cut.  PS you do know Ridley's got a Blade Runner sequel on his radar too right?   ::) ;) 

I kid you not.
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: drone on on July 13, 2012, 05:30:50 PM
Bladerunner 2 sounds like a bad idea at this point.  I think RS is having a kind of old age crisis where he revisits past glories because he doesn't have much time.
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: judd stephens on July 13, 2012, 07:59:46 PM
He must be getting nostalgic on the one hand, but I credit him for trying to go in a unique direction with this, and I have nothing against the idea.  A lot of us have dreamed about this but it's been so long in the making.  To quote Noomi's character... "We were SO WRONG."   :P


 I'd like to see Christopher Nolan's take on Prometheus or Blade Runner 2, the type of director that put enough emphasis back on the characters and their motivations and conflicts.  What I would like to see is more of a different kind of alternate reboot, like a movie version of Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep. 
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: 9dragons on August 24, 2012, 09:07:17 PM
Thanks for posting that vid above Judd, it got me sparked up to think about Prometheus again. Actually, it feels like I haven't stopped thinking about it since first seeing it a week after it came out. The first sequence on the waterfall had me staring in wonder, and I turned to my friend sitting there and we just nodded in approval. Then comes that wonderful shot of the ship, like a tiny comet, engulfed in space, and all the wonderful scenes with David in the beginning, that seemed classic cinema to me. As the movie began to fall apart (as I thought at the moment) with all the incongruous idiocy wrecking the mood, I seriously started to fidget in my seat and had a sour urge to walk the hell out of the theater. Even some of the excellent money shots towards the end did not mitigate the jarring stupidity of the rest of the film. As the credits rolled, I walked out with my friend shaking my head...

Then went back to see it a week later. Then again, a few days after that. Then a fourth time. I've remarkably ended up absolutely fascinated by this movie, partly because I just revel in Ridley Scott's graphic sense, and the way he's able to communicate with film. Partly due to the exquisite design of the film, the sets, and beasts, and the seeming restraint in the use of CG. Scott has a way of restraining himself so that when the insane and unreal moments come, they feel real. The scene with the Engineer battling the giant squid baby was an absolute delight. And so much more.

So I've gone back and watched Alien and Blade Runner (studied them more accurately), and realized that a lot of the criticisms that could be applied to Prometheus can also be leveled at these earlier films, regardless of how "classic" they are now. The thing is, is that the mastery of the vision overrides the missteps, just as it does in Prometheus.

For me, Prometheus is one of the best big time theater movies to come out in quite a while. Avatar is not good for me anymore, and though stunning on a first watch, was awful upon a second. Prometheus, I hated on the first viewing and then, once I cleared my head of my initial reactions, was able to watch it again and again with great entertainment and to get a lot of mileage out of it. This film seems to have generated more imaginative discussion than any I can remember. I'm enjoying that aspect very much.

Excited to dive into the DVD when it comes out.
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: drone on on August 27, 2012, 12:12:09 PM
I'll be interested to see what my reaction to the DVD is, but honestly since I saw the movie opening day I haven't thought about it one bit, until perusing this thread again today. 
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: Bill Binkelman on August 27, 2012, 06:39:25 PM
I finally saw it about a month ago at a second run theater and I hated it. Hated the characters, whom I found all annoying to the max - yes, even the android. The SFX which I thought would be good were mediocre at best. The plot holes were so huge that it made the Transformers series look realistic (honestly, how does a tiny alien which somehow survives being cut out of its host grow to be so big in a food-less environment???   and getting up from a table and running around after abdominal surgery????), and the story itself was so pointlessly pretentious as to be laughable. Where are Joel, Crow, Tom Servo and Gypsy when you need them? Easily the biggest disappointment I have had since Star Wars I, II, and III. The music sucked, too. I truly HATED this film and there are few movies I really and truly HATE, but this is one of them.
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: drone on on August 28, 2012, 12:25:00 PM
Ha ha!  Yeah, the gumby creatures were stupid and the characters you just didn't care for at all.  Plot full of holes. Yep!  The only reason I can't say I "hated" it was because I thought the first 15 min. or so were excellent. 
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: Antdude on November 15, 2012, 01:51:32 PM
I thought this review made a good(and pretty funny) bookend to the discussion on our collective disappointment:

http://minx.cc/?post=334956 (http://minx.cc/?post=334956)

Enjoy.
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: drone on on November 15, 2012, 04:08:35 PM
Some good points, although I don't agree the events in Prometheus were "hundreds of years" earlier.  That is plain wrong.  What I thought was weird was the interior controls on the Prometheus looked way more advanced than the Nostromo. 
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: mgriffin on November 15, 2012, 04:19:09 PM
The events of Prometheus were decades before Alien... 30 years I think.

Prometheus is one of those movies that generates such widely divergent opinions. I think it depends on what people were hoping for going in. People who wanted a Cameron-like big-budget Hollywood spectacle were disappointed. People who wanted a prequel exploring how the aliens came about seemed to like it a lot.
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: Altus on November 17, 2012, 03:45:39 PM
What I thought was weird was the interior controls on the Prometheus looked way more advanced than the Nostromo.
The official answer is: When the Prometheus was built, they spared no expense and used all-current tech. The Nostromo was simply a long-haul towing ship for mined materials. It didn't need to be fancy, it just needed to work.
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: Julio Di Benedetto on November 23, 2012, 07:25:33 AM
A co-worker said he recently saw a movie called Prometheus and was sort annoyed that the movie seemed to borrow quite heavily from the Alien movies, which he liked.   I told him it was the prequel to the Alien movies......with a look of astonishment he said "Now it all makes sense".  Suggest that Prometheus is that different that perhaps only Sci Fi junkies put it together, though I can't image how someone could not see the connection.
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: drone on on November 24, 2012, 11:24:38 PM
Hahaha!  If I ever need brain surgery I hope he's not involved in any way ;D
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: judd stephens on November 26, 2012, 01:33:00 PM
Well after a couple viewings on DVD after one theatrical viewing, I still hold it in a positive light. 

Just addressing a couple criticisms of the movie...  The Music:  Were people expecting a more "Alienesque" scarry ambient music?  I know I was at first, and the more melodic, slightly symphonic and choral music surprised me at first, but let's face it.  This movie is more of a grand beginning, an exploration with the highest of hopes, of the wonderment of a distant and remote world and culture unknown.... and the obvious melancholy, menacing undertones- the opening music (which also plays while David is toying around with the engineer's controls of the holographic universe) sets the scene perfectly.  Prometheus Theme Song (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ruIkwH8Fzsk#ws)


In fact the music has a more Star Trekkian feel and that's appropriate.  Big adventure, big stakes, and big discoveries, good and bad (well, mostly bad  :) )  The cold isolationist ambient of Alien isn't really the right tone you want. 

Anyway the Star Trek reference leads me to the next often criticism  The Dialogue- this was a very corporate, top-down mission for many of the members of the crew.  The parts where the captain is flying the ship, it all seems appropriately regimented, if not cheesy at times.  I just wonder if this criticism would have been leveled to the dialogue had this been a Star Trek movie, for example- doubtful.   I do love the spontaneous dialogue and free-for-all tension in Alien, and Ridley Scott said that he often "pushed the actors' buttons" while putting the camera on them.  There isn't much of that in Prometheus, and I would say the dialogue in Alien is better, but Prometheus does have a few moments of sheer WTF anachary as people are completely put out of their element. 

Also the character of the Captain:  for all the criticism of the geologist and the biologist, I really liked the Captain. There's more of his character than meets one viewing and upon second viewing I liked his acting and considered him the strongest and the hero of the 2nd tier characters. 

I understand the blu-ray version is pretty beefy with extras and has a fight scene between Shaw and the Engineer.  From the bits I saw and hearing Scott's explanation, he rightly left it out.  Also there's one extra scene I saw on the DVD I'm really glad they left out.  It was a fight between Hathaway and Shaw right before he unknowingly impregnates her with the alien.  It's just such a weird and unbelievable exchange, very much like Deckard and Rachel in Blade Runner, that it left me feeling relieved that they let it go...

Anyway rumor is the sequel will be called "Paradise", perhaps an ironic title for sure... looking forward to it.
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: drone on on November 26, 2012, 04:24:52 PM
Judd I totally agree with you on your post.  After watching it on DVD a couple times I was able to appreciate it much more, so I would encourage anyone who saw it in the theater and hated it to give it a second chance.  Yeah, the deleted scenes were dumb and RS made the right choice to leave them out. 

I hear RS is making a Blade Runner sequel and then "Paradise" follows. 
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: judd stephens on November 26, 2012, 09:32:58 PM
Welcome aboard DroneOn to the True Believer fanclub  ;)

I even heard there might be a Alien/Blade Runner tie-in but these are how crazy rumors get spread.  No matter how you slice it, it seems as if RS is going for Legacy-Franchise status. 

There is another apsect I forgot to mention that I noticed in the DVD but not in the movie.  Also thanks in part goes to that video of the Prometheus walkthrough:  Apparently there is a Christianity backstory that seems like it may very well get answered.  I didn't think much of it the first time but now it is so blatantly obvious after about 3 rounds of watching. 

The Prometheus walkthrough mentioned this and was using some outside references (even suggesting that Jesus may have been an Engineered superhuman or something), but look at the evidence:  The Engineers had been asleep for about 2000 years when they were embarking on their mission to destroy humanity.  The Prometheus vessel arrives on the planet Christmas Day- remember the captain setting up the tree?  Shaw's character is deeply religious and her faith is tested w/multiple references.  Her pregnancy is "immaculate" though with destruction and not with salvation. 

These are just some of the loose ends that have hardly been loosened, much less tied up.  It'll be interesting to see how it works out.  I'm not a big fan of any supernatural or Christian underpinnings so hopefully it steers clear of that direction. 

Another deleted scene I forgot about was between Vickers and Weyland.  It's basically the same thing where she "kisses him goodbye" in a not so warm fashion, she knows he's going to meet his fate, you learn she is his daughter, and it lasts a bit longer than the scene in the movie.  BTW how old was he when he had her?  I mean she looks about 30, he looks about 130!  Viagra of the future must be a hell of a drug... I actually liked the deleted scene better, and in it she does mention "that worm" or whatever squirming around in the medic room.  So it's as if they were aware of the alien but not of what it would turn into or that it would grow so quickly.   

I read something else that mentioned a possible debate within Shaw's character whether or not to attach the android's head in the sequel.  Sounds like she may continue to be suspicious of his motives even without Weyland in the picture.  I have to wonder that she would need him fully equipped, in body to help her at all, assuming the Engineers will be hostile, but who knows?  Maybe the aliens will be running the madhouse, and strange alliances develop... such a vast landscape in front for this 2nd movie, no idea how they'll do it, but eager to see.
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: drone on on November 26, 2012, 11:30:11 PM
Yeah, the Christianity theme was pretty blatant on my second viewing.  I also liked the longer scene better between weyland n vickers.  Forgot about that.  One mystery for me is what looked like a queen alien on the wall of the shrine room.  Did I imagine that???  I'm thinking, could this be the Engineers' god?  there's a closeup of it at one point.
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: judd stephens on November 27, 2012, 02:32:55 PM
You didn't imagine it.  The alien is a form of a crucifix... just wait till the fundamentalists hear about this  :)



(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-fef0q67y6uw/T8znvCKwIBI/AAAAAAAABd8/FUnvnQ-wzCw/s1600/prometheus+alien+mural+crop.jpg)
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: drone on on November 27, 2012, 04:05:25 PM
So what do you think this means?  The Xenomorphs created the Engineers, or what?? I'm confused.
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: judd stephens on November 27, 2012, 06:47:04 PM
I think I'll let the mystery be on this one, DroneOn.  There are couple half-baked ideas but just wackiness I haven't really thought it through at this point.  "thought it through"- yeah like there's really some kind of logical process in all of this!
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: drone on on November 28, 2012, 04:26:29 PM
Judd, I think it would be really cool if in "Paradise" Shaw and David find out the "real" aliens are the xenomorphs and that the Engineers were "robots", or genetic machines if you will, created by the xenomorphs, which will show how technology can get so streamlined with genetics and everything that it's hard to tell what is manufactured and what is a living being.  I don't know if this is one of the wacky ideas being tossed around, but I guess I really want the xenomorphs to be the real aliens because the Engineers looked like WWF wrestlers.   ;D
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: judd stephens on November 28, 2012, 11:59:29 PM
I'll have to get back to you DroneOn, but in the meantime, if anyone needs a refresher, as long as this may remain up on youtube: 


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYoLcH72QCc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYoLcH72QCc)
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: drone on on November 29, 2012, 11:28:29 AM
I forget whose post it was but recently someone referred to the crew landing on the "planet."  Wasn't it actually a moon?
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: drone on on November 29, 2012, 11:29:48 AM
PS: that link is not available due to copyright claim by Fox.   :(
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: judd stephens on December 06, 2012, 01:16:42 PM
Judd, I think it would be really cool if in "Paradise" Shaw and David find out the "real" aliens are the xenomorphs and that the Engineers were "robots", or genetic machines if you will, created by the xenomorphs, which will show how technology can get so streamlined with genetics and everything that it's hard to tell what is manufactured and what is a living being.  I don't know if this is one of the wacky ideas being tossed around, but I guess I really want the xenomorphs to be the real aliens because the Engineers looked like WWF wrestlers.   ;D

Are the xenomorphs really that intelligent?  I find it hard to imagine the prototypical Alien with his fangs and claws, looking through microscopes and holding delicate beakers!  They just don't seem like they have the patience if you will.  But it's pretty clear from Prometheus that the whole life generating and changing "goo" found in the vases became the xenomorphs (through the help of both human pregnancy and the engineer as the hosts), at least the one at the end of the movie.  Maybe if your scenario were true the original xenomorphs have far greater intelligence and are more evolved, wherein the aliens we are familiar with are just combinations of genetic breeding.  Not sure I'd be satisfied with that direction, but there is definitely the question of where the engineers came from and how exactly they were able to engineer anything (the best sci-fi explanation), if they decide to answer that at all.

Too bad that link went down, I watched it once more and thinking later, I may have caught a movie mistake:

Remember when Shaw stumbles into Weyland's room after the surgery?  There are numerous people surrounding him, including David and the "bodyguard" guy who ends up dying by the hands of the Engineer in the bridge.  I seem to remember a few extra people in that room- there were 2 very identical looking guys standing guard right at the door.  Is it me or were they completely unaccounted for later- happened to them?  Only people who died in the bridge of the Engineer ship were Weyland, the "bodyguard", the woman with the thick Scottish accent... anyone else?  It seemed some of Weyland's attendants were completely cut out and forgotten about- wouldn't they have come to the bridge of the Prometheus ship as it was taking off without Weyland (and about to go head-first into the other ship)?

Maybe they were in the rover waiting outside the big dome while all that was going down and never had time to make it back...
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: Seren on January 09, 2013, 01:27:18 AM
well I've just got this on Blu Ray - will watch sometime soon.
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: darkenedsoul on January 09, 2013, 03:54:45 AM
Got it on blu-ray as well recently but have not watched it. I guess I'll have to pay attention to this closely to give any thoughts/questions when I get around to watching it. Who are these engineers?
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: drone on on January 09, 2013, 11:27:37 AM
Let us know how all the extras are on the bluray!  :)
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: Seren on January 16, 2013, 01:12:40 PM
I've watched this twice now and have to say that I was surprised I enjoyed it so much.

I've decided to write my thoughts without rereading all the previous comments. I may repeat what others have said but I may also add new ingredients.

The filming is stunning, the sets great and the effects awesome.

I was already aware of the 'reality' issue of Dr Shaw running around after major surgery - so perhaps I was less 'shocked' when i saw it, i also thought I am watching a film about Aliens creating us, so perhaps suspending belief can accomodate this.

I felt that the film was similar to the original 'Alien' because it leaves more questions than answers, which I like (rather than the franchise sequels which seemed to focus on the singular visceral battle between humans and aliens).

I also like that it opens the field up to a range of possible presequel sequels - including following Dr Shaw's journey or further exploring the evolution of the 'Alien'.

I thought the film had more characters than the original but mostly less developed. I thought it was lazy to have the neurotic weedy mapper and the geeky biologist as the negative characters that die off first. At least the negative characters in the original also had 'heroic' moments as well.

I was surprised that the guy who maps the complex got lost...... :o

There were a number of continuity flaws, including lots of flashing lights in the long shots during the storm rescue, but none in the close shots. also where did David get that solid looking ladder? the captain asked the 2 lost guys "where are you" when they were clearly indicated in the 3D map.

Similar to the original alien where the blood dissolves floors but but is staunched by a cotton wool swab, the helmet of the mapper is affected but nothing else touch by the copious spray is.

I thought the range of Alien lifeforms was interesting and again raised more questions than answers - the worms arising as soon as they stepped into the inner sanctum showed that it was not all in storage. The thing in the other doctors eye and the initial moving of the top of the vessel david looked at. I have read that these may indicate an evolution of the alien lifeform, but they seemed different and seperate to me, even if the procreation methods were similar for most.

The different effects of some alien life on human, why is that?

Why did the vase david picked up neither ooze nor have the top become less solid?

I thought the use of the huge deaths-head carving on the  outside wall was unecessary - it was so big they would have seen it going in.

Why did the dead engineers head explode?

Why did shaw and the vickers run along the line of the falling spaceship when a sideways movement of very little would have been easier?

why would such a clever race of beings create a cache of extremely dangerous (even to themselves) living biological weapons to destroy humanity (and or others) when a mass delivery in aerosol form of the DNA breakdown liquid would be much safer?

The extras include a slightly different beginning a few extended or deleted scenes and the fight between Shaw and the last engineer was longer - it included a small part where the engineer saw the replay of the message sent that included the girl playing the violin. Although no sound you could see the engineer was understanding that the humans could play music, and this seemed to make a difference, like recognising a companion soul - until he tried to kill Shaw anyway.

I noted david called dr Shaw Lisbeth when complimenting her on getting the alien out of her stomache - a subtle reference to her earlier films....

My two penneth worth....




Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: drone on on January 16, 2013, 04:25:09 PM
You ask too many questions. 

Why ask why?  ;D
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: Seren on January 16, 2013, 04:52:12 PM
 ;D That's been said to me since i was a small child   ;D
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: Altus on January 18, 2013, 06:12:52 PM
Seren, reading your comments reminded me of this.  ;D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-x1YuvUQFJ0 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-x1YuvUQFJ0)
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: APK on January 18, 2013, 06:33:41 PM
That video sums it up.  ;D

And I loved:

You ask too many questions.

Why ask why?  ;D
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: darkenedsoul on March 21, 2013, 08:51:33 PM
OK, apparently we came from the DNA of the Engineers, got that - check....we find them, one left alive goes spazzo and kills most and tries to leave the planet headed for earth to deliver the aliens....WHY? It'll be interesting to see if a) he does complete the sequel and b) how the lone woman heading to Engineer planet deals with things/what happens there....

I thought they were on earth when the one engineer drinks the nasty black goo and transforms while falling into the water and DNA dissolves/changes/re-combines...I thought that he was on Earth and most say the same.... and we have the evil robot and I knew what he was going to do once he said "organic" then met the buzzed scientist in the lounge...

So what do you all think will come from the next movie? I want to know why they want to launch the aliens to our planet for one thing, secondly I don't think it has been answered as to how/why they created the aliens (did they? still not sure here...). Still was a decent movie overall....but I am trying to figure out how the one person changed to look like an Engineer and was kicking major ass on the crew...who was he? The irishman was dead, other one got impregnated and I am not sure if he was brought back to the ship....if he was...then why was he looking like one of the Engineers?

Will be interesting to see how he ties things in for the next one, if he does do it....

Mike
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: Seren on June 30, 2013, 02:47:34 PM
recently watched Alien resurrection for the first time....

....why did Sigourney weaver sign up to it? the story, acting and dialogue was terrible....almost a parody of itself.
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: drone on on July 01, 2013, 02:13:36 AM
Yeah that was awful.  There never should have been any sequels or prequels to Alien, just kind of ruined the mystique of the original.
Title: Re: Prometheus Musings, and More (Discussion W/ Spoilers)
Post by: 9dragons on September 20, 2013, 12:12:44 PM
The Prometheus question: More than one year on from its release, does it actually hold up? I own it, I've watched it many times, I've pretty much studied it. There is a tremendous amount there in this movie to give it enough weight, to not entirely write it off as a failure. And that's what makes the stupidity of its script failings so irksome. With the original Alien, we were given that this would be a kind of "Texas Chainsaw Massacre" in space, and when you see the movie, it wildly exceeds your expectations, totally transcending the genre. Prometheus does just the opposite. It promises a majesterial space adventure tinged with horror, but turns out to be a post-modern schlock space horror comedy. Which might ruin the enjoyment on first watch (I was so angry I had a hard time not walking out of the theater) but upon successive re-watch Scott's ability as a visual communicator (the whole point of movies right?) is so powerful that the force of it overwhelms the weaknesses and it becomes by sheer force of visual will an awesome piece of work that is worthy of consideration.

Not a failure, much to be gained by it. Strangely, in some nuanced ways, it is not only a prequel to Alien, but a sequel to Blade Runner.