Author Topic: The Black Hole Reverb  (Read 45802 times)

Paul Vnuk (Ma Ja Le)

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #20 on: November 27, 2008, 09:20:56 AM »
I think that sums it up perfectly Campus!

Paul
"I liken good ambient to good poetry ... enjoyable, often powerful, and usually unpopular" APK

LNerell

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #21 on: November 27, 2008, 11:57:26 AM »
As I said, PCM70 is quite affordable, but I still skeptical for some reason... cause it is such a old product, would like to know how it compares to the newer Lexicon reverbs such as PCM96. And how come no reverbs above PCM90 is mention, why do they not sound as good when they are based on the same algorithms ?

Back about 5 years ago just before I bought my TC Reverb 4000 on ebay I bid on and won a Lexicon 300. The 300 was the budget version to their 480L, sort of like my 4000 is the budget version of TC's 6000. As I said I won the auction but the seller had no feedback and would not work with me on a third party arrangement like going through a broker, so I let it go and got the 4000 instead. I'm sure if I had gotten the 300 I would have been a very happy person. :)

These days if I were in the market for a Lexicon verb I would probably check out the PCM96. From the reviews I have read it has that signature Lexicon sound, and the real interesting part is it has a firewire connection and can be used like any plug-in in your DAW software.

As a side note if you were seriously interested in the H7600, I would check out the H8000FW instead, which also has firewire connections, although I am not sure if they have plug-in integration like the PMC96.
Take care.

- Loren Nerell

Ekstasis

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #22 on: November 27, 2008, 12:11:30 PM »
One of the liberating aspects of the way in which a lot of artists make their music these days is
that there are a lot of affordable tools available which are (arguably) almost as good as expensive
(and unattainable for most artists) high-end gear. I agree with APK's earlier point in this regard.

Yep, like Burgundy, Eqs and vintage guitar valve amps, its down to 'taste' ultimately. Naturally
some people have a lot more experience to judge their choices by, but others shouldn't feel that
their opinions are not valid. 
 
Immersion, you might want to try out these Lexicon Impulses from 'Noisevault':

http://noisevault.com/nv/index.php?option=com_remository&Itemid=29&func=selectcat&cat=7

There's PCM70 and PCM91 sets there amongst many others.

cheers
Pete


Really great, if they are professional done impulses that is...
I know about Noise vault for some time now, last time I did try to get some cabinet impulses for my POD.

I see the PCM impulses have got 4 stars, so I guess it is not perfect, however I will try to have a look
at the forum to see if there is any feedback. I am very interested to try anyhow, but
there is a big difference in quality of impulses, that is what differ "halls of fame" which is recording in 32 bit professional studio, in such circumstances you can get very near the reality with impulses.


Ekstasis

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #23 on: November 27, 2008, 12:17:42 PM »
As I said, PCM70 is quite affordable, but I still skeptical for some reason... cause it is such a old product, would like to know how it compares to the newer Lexicon reverbs such as PCM96. And how come no reverbs above PCM90 is mention, why do they not sound as good when they are based on the same algorithms ?

Back about 5 years ago just before I bought my TC Reverb 4000 on ebay I bid on and won a Lexicon 300. The 300 was the budget version to their 480L, sort of like my 4000 is the budget version of TC's 6000. As I said I won the auction but the seller had no feedback and would not work with me on a third party arrangement like going through a broker, so I let it go and got the 4000 instead. I'm sure if I had gotten the 300 I would have been a very happy person. :)

These days if I were in the market for a Lexicon verb I would probably check out the PCM96. From the reviews I have read it has that signature Lexicon sound, and the real interesting part is it has a firewire connection and can be used like any plug-in in your DAW software.

As a side note if you were seriously interested in the H7600, I would check out the H8000FW instead, which also has firewire connections, although I am not sure if they have plug-in integration like the PMC96.

Some months ago, I was actually thinking about buying the Lexicon MX200 Processor, even though it contains "the legendary algorithms" as stated in the product description I doubt it can be compared with the high end products, now I am looking for the TC electronics G-Major instead.

The PCM96 would be a wet dream to own for sure, unfortunately the price is VERY expensive at least here in EU, for that money I can buy a lot of other studio equipment it is really no choice for me. But I guess that might be considered to be the ultimate Reverb Processor, unless you prefer Eventide maybe...

And yeah regarding Eventide,  if I had the money I would buy the H8000FW for sure, I could only imagine what a great guitar tone I would get with that processor :)


ffcal

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #24 on: November 27, 2008, 03:28:05 PM »
There's an interesting article by Myles Boisen in this month's Electronic Musician about creating space in mixes.  He refers to most free reverb plug-ins and inexpensive outboard reverb processors as having high coloration:

http://emusician.com/tutorials/space-place-part/

And...oh yeah, happy thanksgiving, everyone!

Forrest
« Last Edit: November 27, 2008, 03:31:19 PM by ffcal »

darkenedsoul

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #25 on: November 28, 2008, 03:59:44 PM »
I use SIR 1.011 version (free) and he has a commercial one available as well. I also purchased all 3 Impulse Response releases from Spectral Canyon and use them pretty much any time I use SIR in my tunes. Reasonably priced as well.

Here's the link: http://www.knufinke.de/sir/

Mike

Ekstasis

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #26 on: December 01, 2008, 01:16:02 PM »
There's an interesting article by Myles Boisen in this month's Electronic Musician about creating space in mixes.  He refers to most free reverb plug-ins and inexpensive outboard reverb processors as having high coloration:

http://emusician.com/tutorials/space-place-part/

And...oh yeah, happy thanksgiving, everyone!

Forrest


Interesting article...

Ekstasis

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #27 on: December 01, 2008, 01:26:22 PM »
I use SIR 1.011 version (free) and he has a commercial one available as well. I also purchased all 3 Impulse Response releases from Spectral Canyon and use them pretty much any time I use SIR in my tunes. Reasonably priced as well.

Here's the link: http://www.knufinke.de/sir/

Mike



I have used SIR, it is the best FREE convolution reverb for sure (not much competition though). The biggest drawback with the free version is that you can't use the equalizer on the impulses. The included impulses compared with others are not topclass. I have heard also compared to other convultion reverbs that it does color the sound a lot. Personally I prefer Waves IR1, it both sounds better and you have way more settings and parameters to form the sound.

sonic

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #28 on: December 13, 2008, 05:03:22 AM »
hi guys , i'm a bit slow on this one and just drifted in but ive used obsessively reverbs for years and also made it a bit of a focus .

on a budget ?

lexicon Lxp5 or Lxp1 or Lxp15
Line 6 verbzilla

These things can work wonders.

Impulses are also wonderfull but wont get you the same results as a live signal through an h8000 or Lexicon Pcm70/.The Pcm70 ? well like the earlier lexicons it had something people still go on about , there is a reason its famous , because it sounds Way better than anything new they made on many levels , warmer , lushious and just magic.Everything went clinical as specs became the battleground and now its all to pure for my ears.Impulses can suffer this , i tried and tried them and do use them on secondary 'distant ' parts and i love them for plates and stuff but for super expansive ? well i have to use hardware , i cant get that sound any other way.

The black hole reverb is i think modulated reverb ?so the reverb is falling in pitch very very slowly.......down....The H8000 i have used , its jaw dropping for taking a sine wave and turning it into an outspace landscape but again , they enginneered out the H3000's organicness to my ears.I still wouldnt say no to the H8000 ! fully modular and i worked witha  patch that had a pmc70 emulation going through an emt plate emulation , a dimension d emulation and then another pcm70 emulation and wow.......on headphones it was incredible , there are somethings software wont ever do.The H8000 has no vst support and cant be used as a plugin but ive seen it used as a send effect in cubase sx via adat and its good for that.

In all honesty though go for these if you in the real world and relative to your cash - Lxp5/1 Lxp15 . Pcm70 , Roland sde 330 , sdx 330 , Fireworx .

LNerell

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #29 on: December 13, 2008, 11:34:42 AM »
on a budget ?

lexicon Lxp5 or Lxp1 or Lxp15
Line 6 verbzilla

The LXP5 doesn't have reverb, at least mine doesn't. I've heard that the Alesis wedge is pretty decent and cheap too. If you can stretch your budget to around $300 then you can get the Sony R7, an excellent underrated reverb. I can tell you that Robert Rich, A Produce, and myself all use one if that makes any difference.

Roland sde 330 , sdx 330 , Fireworx .

Neither of those Rolands are reverbs (its the SRV-330 from that line), I have a Fireworx and I don't like the verb in that box for some reason.

The H8000 has no vst support and cant be used as a plugin but ive seen it used as a send effect in cubase sx via adat and its good for that.

The current H8000 is the H8000FW which also offered a firewire interface, but you are correct in that their is no plug-in support, maybe the H9000 will?  ;D BTW I stlll use all my hardware devices within my workstation software (Logic Studio) either via adat, spdif, or plan old analog, it works great.  :)
Take care.

- Loren Nerell

hdibrell

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #30 on: December 13, 2008, 10:43:18 PM »
I will concur on the Lexicon LXP-15. I have the LXP-15II and it is great for a fairly low  budget reverb.   Harry
Never regret money spent on old books, old dogs or old friends.

Numina

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #31 on: December 18, 2008, 04:32:49 PM »
I used to be more of a reverb snob than I am now... I'm finding built-in reverbs in several synths to be as good as expensive outboard units (gasp!)  The V-Synth GT and my Virus TI as examples.

I too have an Eclipse and love its verbs.  They are more transparent compared to Lexicon or TC, but you can densen them up a bit with programming.  I have anyway.

I have been plpeasantly surprised with the TC M-One XL.  Gorgeous reverb to my ears.  Only drawback is the longest you can decay a reverb is 20 seconds.  That's peanuts for ambient music!  How about 200 seconds!  ;) Just kidding... but it's a really nice sounding reverb.

I have used the Lexicon MPX-1 on many of my recordings. "Sanctuary of Dreams" and "Eye of the Nautilus" have heavy doses of the MPX1.  I like the PCM 80 too, but as others have pointed out it's hissy (noisy).  I wouldn't mind an upgrade at this point but I'm fine with these units.

Jesse


Ekstasis

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #32 on: January 11, 2009, 05:39:27 PM »
Alright, I did listen to the mp3 demo of the Eventide H8000FW. Even though it cost a fortune I will do anything in my power to get this processor... Yeah it is a A LOT of money..especially for one who is unemployed.
But I think as it looks now that I will save up money to buy it...

I did compare the mp3 samples with the much cheaper Eventide Eclipse, it was like night and day really..could not compare...

Ekstasis

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #33 on: January 30, 2009, 08:33:22 PM »
Have anyone tried the Acousticas Impulse reverb, from the Lexicon 300 unit ???
http://www.acousticas.net/

On certain "audiophile" forums this is regarded superior to other impulses on the market...

Ekstasis

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #34 on: February 16, 2009, 12:17:56 PM »
Eventide H8000FW impulses

http://www.v-synthesis.com/

deepspacenetworks

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #35 on: February 17, 2009, 08:02:10 AM »
greetings guys , i'm new here and kind of lerk ;).....

these h8000 are very very deep and made for deep ambience.Vsig was used and multiple reverbs feed into each other , its a  quick way to make amazing spaces and i cant recommend these enough for deep ambient music  , not strong on small spaces as much.Also some great 'weird ' spaces and also 3d / hass effects and delays.If i had to have 1 impulse library for ambient then this is it ! also checkout the h3000 for sale which is mroe grainy but also has some massive huge spaces and maybe better dark stuff ?

matt



Eventide H8000FW impulses

http://www.v-synthesis.com/

deepspacenetworks

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #36 on: February 17, 2009, 10:19:50 AM »
? i'm stunned by that one mate........did you use the eventide h8000 ? or try its pcm70 patch ? using vsig ?  its emt140 patch ? The h8000 is stunning for deep ambient using its reverb abilities.........stunning.

great deep spaced reverb >?i cant think of anything that comes close  to the h8000  on some levels for reverb  - its modular >? how about a pcm70 patch in it run through a  plate and then another pcm70 patch ? deep reverb ? .I know the bricasti and pcm stuff and its superb but really i think what you say there is very very wrong or a tad dodgy .I will agree tradition suggests we grab a lexicon but really the h8000 blows away any other reverb i have used for many things , it wont do a  bricasti sound i will agree but ' deep space reverb ' ? its the most amazing deep ambient space generator due to its modular nature .I have used an h8000 with vsig and it is jaw dropping Without the pitchshifting even turned on......just for reverb.

regards cheap alternatives the lxp5 and lxp 1 do have reverb ,both do reverb - but really need soundiver to be edited well.2 x lxp5 in parallel one set to pitch shift and one to reverb do so very eventidish spaces.I personally think unless your heavy into hardware these h8000 impulses and these bricasti and lex ones below are enough and to be frank most people wouldnt know the difference , in a blind test these hi end impulses are fooling many pros.....

http://studiodevices.com/








If you are after a great deep space reverb, then you should not look at Eventide, regardless of the preset name on the H7600. Now the H7600 is indeed a great, incredible effects processor, but I don't think you will find many in the pro studio world who would reach for an Eventide unit for just reverbs. They are more known for their pitch shifting, harmonizing and spacial stereo algorythms, but not verbs. I have the Eventide Eclipse which is a great effects unit, but the verbs are pretty bad...
« Last Edit: February 17, 2009, 11:53:21 AM by deepspacenetworks »

Ekstasis

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #37 on: February 17, 2009, 11:23:00 PM »
yeah I am currently saving up for this beast...I hope to be able to get it this year...
I might take a loan for it also...
If you buy it on ebay used...it gets kind of affordable...

I will use it for both ambient and extreme metal music, and as guitar effect processor.. With the POD X3/Tonelab LE

Exuviae

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #38 on: March 19, 2009, 03:52:20 PM »
I was addicted to reverb units a number of years ago and was insanely particular about noise levels, artifacts, etc. I struggled with this for a long time - buy,sell,trade,etc - until, almost by accident I opted for a cheaper machine to use as a general multi-fx unit and had planned to ignore the reverb pretty much out of the box. Then I bought it and brought it home and accidentally loaded a reverb patch as the first thing I tried on it...at that point, my outlook on not just reverb-but all hardware gear and plug-ins alike changed drastically to where it remains today...

USE YOUR EARS ABOVE ALL ELSE. Price means nothing if you like the way it sounds. The name on the case or on the screen means nothing if you like the way it sounds. Ears, man...ears...

 ;D

Ekstasis

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Re: The Black Hole Reverb
« Reply #39 on: April 15, 2009, 07:28:42 PM »
http://www.112db.com/redline/reverb have anyone tried it ?
To my ears it sound ok, you can make very long reverbs with it.
But it is not as crystal clear as an hardware reverb probably.