Author Topic: Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music  (Read 2198 times)

Ekstasis

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Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music
« on: November 26, 2013, 05:44:28 PM »
I know in the Ambient music...compressor is not exactly the most used tool...for many reasons..
mostly due it's artifacts..
This is a compressor for the people who do not like compressors due it is artifacts...
For me personally this will be an easy buy the exact type of compressor I am looking for..
very clean and transparent.  more like a "leveler" then a compressor.

http://www.dangerousmusic.com/products/compressor

Dangerous Music Compressor Overview with Fab DuPont - Sweetwater Sound
« Last Edit: November 26, 2013, 08:50:10 PM by Immersion »

El culto

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Re: Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music
« Reply #1 on: November 26, 2013, 06:28:21 PM »
Often you sound like a person advertising products  ;D Have you ever thought about going into this business?

A compressor is a tool to control/balance the volume and or peaks (then the compressor turns into a limiter)….nothing more about it (even you can use it in some extreme FX ways)….and the reason for many people not using it in ambient music is not due artifacts but of the idea to have the dynamic of the music as much natural as possible.

And in 2013 i don´t know any available compressor (software and hardware) with "artifacts" when used in the right way.

Once more, you are talking about esoteric improvements you believe into….thats fine - but "very clean and transparent" needs a prove first and not just a repeating of phrases from the advertising video!

Castleview

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Re: Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music
« Reply #2 on: November 26, 2013, 06:37:35 PM »
I bet that compressor costs an arm and a leg.
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Ekstasis

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Re: Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music
« Reply #3 on: November 26, 2013, 06:38:32 PM »
I bet that compressor costs an arm and a leg.

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Ekstasis

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Re: Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music
« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2013, 06:51:58 PM »
Often you sound like a person advertising products  ;D Have you ever thought about going into this business?

A compressor is a tool to control/balance the volume and or peaks (then the compressor turns into a limiter)….nothing more about it (even you can use it in some extreme FX ways)….and the reason for many people not using it in ambient music is not due artifacts but of the idea to have the dynamic of the music as much natural as possible.

And in 2013 i don´t know any available compressor (software and hardware) with "artifacts" when used in the right way.

Once more, you are talking about esoteric improvements you believe into….thats fine - but "very clean and transparent" needs a prove first and not just a repeating of phrases from the advertising video!

I only promote products I am self considering to buy, If you know Dangerous philosophy and legacy I think you will know better what the product have to offer.

The only compressor I have found accetable in ambient music is SSL X-comp, it does not destroy the mix even with the small details (for me in ambient it is all about the details).

You are saying not many people are using it in ambient, I think what you mean is not many are using it on the masterbus on the full mix.  On individual instruments or tracks I see nothing wrong with compression.
However this compressor might be something I dare to put on the masterpus aswell..just because how clean and transpertent and distort free it seem to be. 

I find it very interesting how you can claim that any software or hardware compressor have no artifacts if used in the right way, and with that I assume you mean extremely mild compression ?  I have tried a lot compressor.
I think especially on the mix it fucks up the sound,  x-comp is really the only exception so far...

Now I might come across like a total compressor guy but the fact is I am kind of an anti-compressor person..
I do not use it more then I have two, I prefer to increase the sound volume and energy in other ways, such as transient designers to get more transients in the mix  also I prefer in the box use different tube plugins such as tube amp and processor. 

Some analgue gear such as Burl Mix Bus, which is a summirizing mixer can add some kind of "compression" but without really adding a compression when you increase the drive in the transformers.

I prefer to add volume that way then using compression the analogue way.. At least on a full mix in ambient music.

However I am only saying that the Dangerous audio Compressor might change that...it might actaully be something one even can but on the masterbus.. if it is as transparent and clean as I think it is.

Paul Vnuk (Ma Ja Le)

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Re: Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music
« Reply #5 on: November 26, 2013, 10:26:30 PM »
First let me say that I love Dangerous products and am the proud owner of their Bax EQ. I wont mix without it. Its filters are great for cleaning up sonic junk. As such I am very curious about their new Compressor and I am sorry I missed the demo and launch of it at AES last month.

You are right Immersion most ambient folks shy away from compressors, me I tend to use 4-12 (mostly hardware) of them on my mixes for creative sonic shaping on percussion and synths and synth leads ect.

On my master buss of EVERY mix I do, along with the above mentioned Bax EQ, and a Kush Claraphonic EQ is the A-Designs Nail compressor and in my opinion from classical to metal to folk and yes ambient and electronic music it is one of the few pieces in my studio that I use on every mix and can't live without. Its a compression that lifts and separates rather than squashes. You should check one out.

They are tricky to uses and if you google Ronan's Roadshow he has a great demo of one. Its on rock, but still gives a cool idea of how it works.

PV
"I liken good ambient to good poetry ... enjoyable, often powerful, and usually unpopular" APK

APK

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Re: Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music
« Reply #6 on: November 27, 2013, 12:42:23 PM »
Just an aside to Paul's post: I see that Kush also have a matching plugin for the Kush Claraphonic EQ.
I wonder how it compares to the hardware version. Only $149.
http://www.thehouseofkush.com/#!the-clariphonic-dsp/csaa
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Ekstasis

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Re: Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music
« Reply #7 on: November 27, 2013, 03:18:22 PM »
First let me say that I love Dangerous products and am the proud owner of their Bax EQ. I wont mix without it. Its filters are great for cleaning up sonic junk. As such I am very curious about their new Compressor and I am sorry I missed the demo and launch of it at AES last month.

You are right Immersion most ambient folks shy away from compressors, me I tend to use 4-12 (mostly hardware) of them on my mixes for creative sonic shaping on percussion and synths and synth leads ect.

On my master buss of EVERY mix I do, along with the above mentioned Bax EQ, and a Kush Claraphonic EQ is the A-Designs Nail compressor and in my opinion from classical to metal to folk and yes ambient and electronic music it is one of the few pieces in my studio that I use on every mix and can't live without. Its a compression that lifts and separates rather than squashes. You should check one out.

They are tricky to uses and if you google Ronan's Roadshow he has a great demo of one. Its on rock, but still gives a cool idea of how it works.

PV

I have seen the BAX EQ in so many studios now..I am very interested to look more into it.. and see how it perform and sound, I think it can be very useful and fast tool.

A lot of people where surprised when Dangerous did present a compressor it has never been there territory, so I know with their legacy that it would be something special...

Looking forward to read some reviews of it and if it lives up the expectations, but I am very sure it will I know they would not release a crap product, especially after been waiting for such a long time to release it.  I think a lot of the sound chain in the box is probably very similiar to the other gear so it will be as clean as any other Dangerous product...I hope it is a compressor you can use on anything to just make it all sound better.

For ambient I think to have a good compressor is even more important.

I think it is mostly the the lower frequencies that can sound really bad with a compressor in ambient music...some people might not hear it but I hear it very clear the artifact.
So I would be careful using it on the low end.  It can be good to use in mid range and high end..to get all the details and transients higher up in the mix to get a more even sound.

Altus

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Re: Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music
« Reply #8 on: November 27, 2013, 05:17:33 PM »
By "artifact", I assume you mean pumping?

I use compressors just to keep transients under control, or just knock down a band of frequencies. I'd be surprised if I was in the minority . . . likely most of us are using compressors while making ambient music.

Correct me if I'm wrong, folks.
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Ekstasis

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Re: Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music
« Reply #9 on: November 27, 2013, 05:27:49 PM »
By "artifact", I assume you mean pumping?

I use compressors just to keep transients under control, or just knock down a band of frequencies. I'd be surprised if I was in the minority . . . likely most of us are using compressors while making ambient music.

Correct me if I'm wrong, folks.

I Guess the pumping effect you describe is one among many artifacts... it just tend to sound "flimsy" and artificial and just bad in general

I use very very mild compression I mostly use the make up knob on my ssl compressor. 

To keep transients under a control you use it more like a limiter ?
Personally I find transients very important in the mix, that is where the attack and clarity is in the sound, so it is a good idea to bring them up.  You can easily see by just watching the spectrum analyzer.

Altus

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Re: Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music
« Reply #10 on: November 27, 2013, 06:02:50 PM »
Personally I find transients very important in the mix, that is where the attack and clarity is in the sound, so it is a good idea to bring them up.

I think you misunderstand my method. I work by subtraction, not addition. I bring down the dominant frequencies in a sound source to bring emphasis to the more delicate elements.

Actually, the more I think about it, the tools I use for this may not be considered a compressor, at least not in the traditional sense.  ::)
http://www.voxengo.com/product/soniformer/
http://www.voxengo.com/product/glisseq/

Soniformer is a much more aggressive tool compared to GlissEQ.
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Re: Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music
« Reply #11 on: November 27, 2013, 06:14:30 PM »
I use compressors just to keep transients under control, or just knock down a band of frequencies. I'd be surprised if I was in the minority . . . likely most of us are using compressors while making ambient music.

Correct me if I'm wrong, folks.

Yep, that's exactly it, Mike.
Unlike an EQ, with a compressor you can keep the spikes and unwanted resonances under control without lowering all the material in that frequency range. I use a multiband compressor a lot in mastering, they are brilliant instruments. I also put a hardware compressor on whatever external synth I'm using, just to gently kick in at high levels and stop possible distortion.

Immersion. This is not to eliminate any attack in the sounds (unless that's what one wants of course), but only to keep the volume profile under control.

And yes, I think a real-time spectrum analyser is one of the most essential tools. I find myself using apEQ a lot on individual tracks and takes, its an EQ plugin with a spectral readout behind it. Very, very useful. Quick too.

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Ekstasis

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Re: Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music
« Reply #12 on: November 27, 2013, 06:16:03 PM »
Personally I find transients very important in the mix, that is where the attack and clarity is in the sound, so it is a good idea to bring them up.

I think you misunderstand my method. I work by subtraction, not addition. I bring down the dominant frequencies in a sound source to bring emphasis to the more delicate elements.

Actually, the more I think about it, the tools I use for this may not be considered a compressor, at least not in the traditional sense.  ::)
http://www.voxengo.com/product/soniformer/
http://www.voxengo.com/product/glisseq/

Soniformer is a much more aggressive tool compared to GlissEQ.


I used the GlissEQ and Soniformer som years ago I can't actually remember  But the soniformer did help perform a more even sound across the frequency spectrum .  Actually, Voxengo release very good sounding plugs for good price, but not the the most pretty plugins but they sound good. I like the Analogflux suite.. I still use it a lot.

For ambient music there is no big need for a compressor to be honest atleast not on the masterbus.  . I prefer to not compress the master at all just bring up the level, I tend to prefer to use a very clean tube amp for that and over drive the signal slightly, I guess that cold be called some kind of tube compression but in a more beautiful way..
As I said I am eager to try the new Dangerous compressor..it might actually change the way I use compressors. 
« Last Edit: November 27, 2013, 09:28:22 PM by Immersion »

Ekstasis

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Re: Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music
« Reply #13 on: November 27, 2013, 06:21:25 PM »
I use compressors just to keep transients under control, or just knock down a band of frequencies. I'd be surprised if I was in the minority . . . likely most of us are using compressors while making ambient music.

Correct me if I'm wrong, folks.


Yep, that's exactly it, Mike.
Unlike an EQ, with a compressor you can keep the spikes and unwanted resonances under control without lowering all the material in that frequency range. I use a multiband compressor a lot in mastering, they are brilliant instruments. I also put a hardware compressor on whatever external synth I'm using, just to gently kick in at high levels and stop possible distortion.

Immersion. This is not to eliminate any attack in the sounds (unless that's what one wants of course), but only to keep the volume profile under control.

And yes, I think a real-time spectrum analyser is one of the most essential tools. I find myself using apEQ a lot on individual tracks and takes, its an EQ plugin with a spectral readout behind it. Very, very useful. Quick too.


Yes soniformer I guess could be seen as some kind of leveler, it is actually a kind of smart tool...you can get a more even mix and with that way you can bring up the volume more safely..

have not tried apEQ, but I can recommend
http://dmgaudio.com/products_equilibrium.php




Ekstasis

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Re: Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music
« Reply #14 on: November 27, 2013, 07:04:39 PM »
Dangerous Music Compressor - AES 2013

Paul Vnuk (Ma Ja Le)

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Re: Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music
« Reply #15 on: November 27, 2013, 11:56:47 PM »
Just an aside to Paul's post: I see that Kush also have a matching plugin for the Kush Claraphonic EQ.
I wonder how it compares to the hardware version. Only $149.
http://www.thehouseofkush.com/#!the-clariphonic-dsp/csaa


I do like the hardware a hair better, but the plug-in is darn close. Its a great tool I use often.
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Julio Di Benedetto

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Re: Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music
« Reply #17 on: November 28, 2013, 06:30:04 AM »


Not a compressor in the strict sense, more of a saturator but its what I use 99% of the time....you actually have to push it quite hard to make it behave as its name suggests.  Just dont touch the punish button.  Its a tone shaper for me





UBK-1: The Concept on Vimeo

This is something Im interested in as a tone shaper


The Electra - Punching Up & Widening the Drum Buss on Vimeo

and this as another tone shaper :)

Ekstasis

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Re: Most likely the best Compressor for Ambient music
« Reply #18 on: November 28, 2013, 09:06:49 AM »


Not a compressor in the strict sense, more of a saturator but its what I use 99% of the time....you actually have to push it quite hard to make it behave as its name suggests.  Just dont touch the punish button.  Its a tone shaper for me





UBK-1: The Concept on Vimeo
This is something Im interested in as a tone shaper


The Electra - Punching Up & Widening the Drum Buss on Vimeo
and this as another tone shaper :)


That is my fav decapitator plug... I use it some time to get the sound more dirty or lo fi..  But it it is not my favorite tube amp.

Yeah ever since I saw the Electra when it was presented long ago I was interested in it...I like the concept... I was about to buy the Gain Train aswell from Kush, but I bought the dangerous source instead, which I think have even better value.