Finding a Mentor? Experience and/or Suggestions?

[Austere]

We're trying to separate out subjects from the other thread since it's gotten confusing and rather long-ish. Hopefully this is OK on the forum? We just posted four times on that thread since we find it very informative and insightful.

One of the other subjects that came up in the "mastering & mentoring" tangents was the belief by several people that having a more experienced musickian / producer / sound engineer work with a less experienced artist as a "mentor" is anything from a Good Idea to a Must Do.

While we ponder about paying someone to master our latest unreleased CD, we're also trying to figure out if we should be looking for someone to mentor us as part of the mastering process, or more likely from the recording all the way to mastering as Cass suggested, which makes the most sense to us.

So we figured we'd ask the people who believe mentoring is helpful for suggestions:

Paul Vnuk & mgriffin seemed to think this was very important after re-reading the entire thread: can either of you make some suggestions of people who you have mentored under or who you think would make a good mentor? Thank you!

[mgriffin]

I don't necessarily think it's "very important" but I do think a beginner in any subject or field can be helped along several steps by a more advanced practitioner or expert, someone willing to share tips or offer advice or point out things the beginner is missing.  It can be a teacher in a class, it can be a friend in the same field who happens to be more experienced, or it might be a professional associate who's willing to share expertise or tips while in the process of working together.  I'd say only rarely is it a matter of seeking out a mentor and saying "please take me under your wing."

I also feel this sort of thing is less and less useful as the beginner gains knowledge and skill of their own.  In other words, a mentor is more useful if the gap between their expertise and your own is wide, but the closer you come to their level, the less they can teach you.  On the other hand, if you're closer to the level of a mentor type person, you'll have more to offer them in exchange.  I believe it's possible for experienced persons, creative or otherwise, to learn things from people who are actually less trained or accomplished than themselves.

[Austere]

I believe it's possible for experienced persons, creative or otherwise, to learn things from people who are actually less trained or accomplished than themselves.

Well put - at university, we learned the concept that "until you try to teach a subject to someone else, you really don't truly understand it."  It sounds like a similar concept. Thank you!

Perhaps it would be fine just to hire someone to master for us and try to work with them on the  process.

[APK]

"until you try to teach a subject to someone else, you really don't truly understand it."

It's more: until you find you can teach it, you are never sure if you really understood it.

[drone on]

Just don't crank the volume to "eleven" and you'll be fine. ;-)

[Sunbreak Music]

I think the cool thing about our digital age is that we can work all by ourselves.  I think the bad thing about it is that we can work all by ourselves.   ;)

Speaking personally, until I started interacting with other artists/producers/engineers/etc. I don't think I was improving at an acceptable rate.  There were quite a few basics that I completely missed simply because I didn't think I had a reason to know them.  Once I started getting into other people's spaces, things seemed to click much, much faster.

I've been fortunate to always find good people to learn from.  I owe a lot to my friend David Helpling, who was willing to give honest (and occasionally painful) feedback years back, but also offered solutions to whatever challenges I was facing.  That was more along the lines of mix engineering, gear talk, and overall pep talks. 

By the time I decided to move to a dedicated mastering studio, I had realized the importance of sitting with people in their space and being right there to ask questions, so I booked and spent time with a few different mastering folks in various parts of the country.  Although I had several projects I engineered/produced where I attended the mastering sessions at a pro facility, this time I was going to be the one turning the knobs.  I learned much.  I talk to other MEs several times a week.

So it's important to see how others work, it's important to listen to your material in other people's studios, and it's important to be in the moment in "real time" to say--"Hey!!!  What did you just do?????  That sounds (insert whatever here)!!!!!". 

I've also found that people are very generous with their time when they can afford it, and even when I booked sessions to learn how to mic an acoustic guitar, they kept going even though my time was up.  Anyone is welcomed to call me (during business hours) and ask about anything, and if someone sends me a mix for opinions I'll take the time to give it a listen--at no charge. 

This week, I learned how to get the tabla sound I always wanted.   ;D



[attachment deleted by admin]

[hdibrell]

I think the cool thing about our digital age is that we can work all by ourselves.  I think the bad thing about it is that we can work all by ourselves.   

What he said!

[ffcal]

I think the mentor concept makes more sense if you are just starting out.  Otherwise, I think you'd be better off speaking with your peers, especially ones that are geographically closest, and getting a feel for what techniques and setups that they prefer, then listening to see if your ears agree.  That said, one of my most valuable lessons was listening to and observing Bob Ohlsson master my Gongland record at Hearts of Space.

Forrest

[Seren]

I'd like to think I can always learn something new, sometimes discovering it myself, but definitely learning from others too.

I drummed for a time in a samba band and learnt a lot that led to an unexpected complementfrom a famous musician - not why I did it (as I still use my drumming for other 'projects' rather than music) but it helped me understand more about my skills.

And unlike John Peel, who was able to stay open minded to all music until he sadly died, I do get into ruts, so feedback from others is essential.

[Blackinfinity]

I think there is a lot on youtube these days... a lot of instructional videos for synth..guitar..drums yes every instrument possible and sound engineering in general.
But I would certainly not mind to participate in some of Steve Roach's workshops...or just observe when he make music in his studio...learn his work flow..

I can recommend this site.

http://www.soundpeek.com/

[doombient]

What do you need a mentor for?

Trust in your own strength, make your own mistakes, learn from these... this is what life is all about.

Stephen

[darkenedsoul]

I pick my buddies brain for Ableton Live stuff as well as peruse their forums quite a bit (lurking mainly unless I have an answer for someone) as he has been using Live a lot longer (since 1.0 I believe) and he introduced me to it. The more I see on youtube blows my mind with what you can do with this beast. It really is a whole lot bigger than I originally thought (and gotten more expansive since I started with 3.02). So I pick his brain and use the forums there for info/ideas/questions.

So to me a mentor can be very helpful in the early stages and as you progress less so, perhaps even showing the mentor something they didn't know down the road ;-)

Mike